Ep. 57: REMOkey provides sustainable products with third-party validation Ankit Podcast

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Ep. 57: REMOkey provides sustainable products with third-party validation

This week’s guest on The WTiN Podcast is Dalia Benefatto, a consultant at REMOkey.

Jessica Owen
Hello. My name is Jessica Owen, and I'm the Deputy digital editor at WTiN, and this is the WTiN podcast. Over the next few weeks, I'll be talking to organizations about the topic of textile recycling. This is one of the most important solutions to the industry's waste and sustainability problems. So tune in to learn about new industry initiatives to create circular fashion upcoming textile recovery technologies. How best to communicate sustainability to consumers and much more. This week, I am joined by Dalia Benefatto, who consults on strategy and sales at remote key. Dalia talks about the company's label and communication solution for textiles made with recycled materials, tips for spotting green washing and how consumers industry and governments need to come together to build a green economy. Good morning, Dahlia, lovely to have you on the show today. How are you? How is everything in Italy?

Dalia Benefatto
Good morning, Jessica, I'm very good. Thanks. And I wish you're doing well the same in Italy. The life is very quiet, as you can imagine, because of the pandemic, so we can't really move around, but actually, there is a lovely day outside today, so this makes me very happy. Yes,

Jessica Owen
of course, I think the weather Cheers everyone up when it's lovely and sunny outside. So we're here today then to talk about Remo key, but before that, tell me a bit about yourself, as I know that you're sort of a consultant, but you also have a lot of other experience. Okay,

Dalia Benefatto
thanks for the question. Well, Remo key is a very important subject, you know. But in any case, just to tell you a little bit of my background and why I started to join this amazing project. I started as a professional dire chemist, and I worked with the international fashion brands, especially in the denim field, as product innovator. And I was supporting fabric, meals and laundry seeking for innovative and ethical products. And this was happening actually a little bit all around the world, so I had the wonderful opportunity to see quite a lot of facilities and companies being part of the supply chain and having the perspective from both sides, let's say the producers and the brands as well, and I'm also one of the lecturer of out of fashion, that is a very interesting course of sustainable and ethical fashion that they are making here in Italy in Milan. So that's a little bit of my of my story, on my background, right?

Jessica Owen
Okay, um, so you're now working with Roy Moki. Do you mind providing some background on this company, on this project? So how long has it been running, and who actually started this?

Dalia Benefatto
Yeah, first of all, thanks for the opportunity, and I'm also very happy to join this amazing company and project that was founded in 2010 by Martin Avik. And he started a project called Remo that stays for recycle movement, and started to develop the idea. After his professional biking career and a career in textile, he became very aware Jessica of the huge environmental impact of the textile chain in the area of Plato in Italy, where, in this area, they recycled since 150 years old. So they have a very strong background and culture about it. So he decided to invest his savings in making the Textile Supply Chain more transparent and to reduce the impact. And also invested a lot in in Prato, where he found a very fertile ground, let's say, to to build up this idea on the recycle movement. So later, he managed to team up with a group of professionals with different background and skills. So there is Anton luken that is a technical specialist in textile processing and environmental impact calculations, and Michelle woolstock As a business development professional with a background in textiles and retails. Sander ladenus That is a graphic designer and is responsible for visual communication for Remo and its customers, and also helps guarding the foundation principles and the general concept of Remo. Ariat will then set that is responsible for The Daily Office Management and. Organize all the back office and financial activities by myself consulting on the strategy and and saves mainly. And in the last two, three years, after many efforts, there has been a professional development following the growing of market awareness. So that's a little bit the found the fundamentals of the project and why it started as well,

Jessica Owen
right? Okay, that's interesting. I mean, you mentioned that a little bit about what the company does, but I understand from your website that there's three key components, so calculation, credibility and communication. So tell me about these things then and what you do exactly

Dalia Benefatto
with pleasure. Because first of all, rimuki aims to motivate people toward more sustainable and conscious choices. And actually this is based on this main three services that the first one is actually calculation. Calculation is based on LCA, life cycle assessment approach. I will give a short definition about it, where LCA is an analysis of the impact that one object has on the world around it. So actually, the principle of the LCA calculation is that for each life cycle stage, you investigate the amounts of material and energy used and emissions associated with the process, so you can understand it's a very serious matter, and the calculation is based on the mapping of the chain of production. That is fundamental to be very aware about your supply chain when you're doing an ethical product, the determination of the final composition, the confirmed recycled percentage, and the calculated environmental savings of recycled versus virgin raw material. So this is the calculation part. Then the second is the credibility. Credibility. Why? First of all, we have to say that every recycled material that a customer would like to communicate with the Remo key program needs to be GRS or RCS certified. Then the credibility is based first of all on the independent validation, because this is very important to be said, Jessica, we are an independent company the transparency of the information. Because actually, all informations, as I will explain, also later, better are communicated to us. So we have all the transparency of the supply chain and about the product, as well building trust and awareness, and this answers also to the demand for truth and validity. And actually, rimki has also made a partnership with process factory, where process factory is actually an Italian company that is specialized in supporting companies to, you know, adopt and also expand their sustainable and ethical practices. So and together with them, that has has been studied an online questionnaire for an initially, initially company assessment. And then we have the communication part that is, you know, very important as marketing is also today everything and is rich and clear, is visually attractive and helps customers to share their sustainability projects, and the communication is also made by the product label with savings and the QR code, QR code that is leading to a client, customized web landing page. The point is that the contribution that companies are making to protect the environment deserves attention, and also in these ways, stories can be shared.

Jessica Owen
Okay, so just going back to the credibility point and the calculation, how difficult is it to calculate and find out all of this information, because I think some people are unaware of how complex and how many steps there are. So is this difficult to do? Well,

Dalia Benefatto
you touched a really right point. Because, okay, just to give you an idea, remu, is you. Using an international database like the Swiss ecoinvent database and data also from other public sources to calculate the reduction of the environmental impact by using recycled textile fibers. Now this in this information are available in a calculation tool developed by the Dutch sector organization for textile and clothing industry. So as you see, is not really an easy matter. Let's say behind there is a lot of work or so far from our sustainable expert. So what is challenging Jessica is to verify the information you get from the supply chain, but we found the method to overcome this issue. Therefore, we have set up an assessment system with Italian company for sustainability that actually is a brand of process factory, the company I was mentioning to you before talking about the credibility point to be sure that the companies in the supply chain are working in a decent manner concerning the use of recycled fiber. Besides, we have created a data and information system called Air is to streamline information and data gathering from the supply chain. So it's quite an articulate part of the work. But actually, starting with the self assessment that actually it's, in any case, a declaration from a company, and you know when the company is declaring something, then it can also be verified, right?

Jessica Owen
Okay, well, yes, it does sound very articulate, as you say. And then you also mentioned with the communication point that you do this through QR codes, and I think you also have an app so these for the consumers to use then, so if they buy a product and they have a label with a QR code, they can use that to see all the information behind this product that they've bought. Is that right? Yes,

Dalia Benefatto
that's right, and also the transparency of the supply chain. But let me give you also some more detail, because we offer our clients a two step communication tool, so the product will have a remote key, suing, label, hand tag or etiquette, showing the percentage of recycled content, the environmental savings and the QR code that you were talking about. This QR code is then leading to a client based web landing page that displays all, or in any case, more information and the full production chain, because, of course, it also is always made together with the customer. So some customer, they want to display full information and the name of their suppliers as well to make the supply chain fully transparent. Some others, they prefer not to do that, but they give the full information to us that, of course, are kept in the more strict confidentiality, and they supply also images and videos and marketing messages that can be enriching the landing page and it's personalized according to the client style and wishes as well, practically in the same tool they can share with business partners and consumers, ethical initiatives, company, Mission philosophy, with a modern approach. Jessica and engage millennials. They are very used to scan and showing special attention about how clothes they like to buy are made. They are very attentive on this kind of subject. Yes,

Jessica Owen
I think a lot of people have said what you've just said that it's millennials, the younger generations, that are really sort of pushing for, um, traceability and transparency. Um, on that note, then do you think one day, every item of clothing will have a label, such as remote case? Well,

Dalia Benefatto
this is what we would like to see, we would like definitely, you know, there is definitely the strong believing that to be really ethical, to be sustainable, brands need to be transparent. There is a very huge need for transparency, because this is the only way to really be clear and also honest with the with the consumers, okay?

Jessica Owen
And I mean, you already work with a number of brands, fabric and even yarn producers. They all use your services and labels now, and is the main reason why they're coming to you is for this. Demand for traceability and transparency that we've been talking about. Yeah, definitely.

Dalia Benefatto
Our clients want to share their sustainable products and the environmental benefits with their customers, so in a credible way, through an independent third party and with a professional communication solution. So with remote services they can, they can communicate in an effective and trustworthy way. So based on the calculation credibility and communication services that we have been discussing before and with an independent company, because this is also also key, because many companies are also trying to adopt their ways and to build their own systems, but it's always like a self declaration while it is involved a third independent party, the, let's say the let's say the message as a different impact. Well,

Jessica Owen
I was wondering if we could talk about any of your clients or people you work with. I think, for example, you've worked with the knitwear company Paradis Perdis. I don't think I've pronounced that correctly, but tell me about some of the people who you've worked with. Then,

Dalia Benefatto
yeah, well, Paradis Perdue is actually a great example you've been mentioning because Thomas Pauly, that is this amazing guy, this French designer that started a brand of his own with a few friends in in New York, and starting with materials that already exist. So He's launching his knitwear label made entirely of recycled material. And, you know, it's a great initiative, and it's a great example of a completely new brand made from these emerging designers that they did a very successful work with with them, proving that new brands have all the opportunity and the right mentality to make a change, because they are front runners as well. And actually, we should not forget, in any case, that there are also existing brands where remote key can offer fully support to differentiate completely the communication for their sustainable product that needs another kind of communication approach and language as well. But Paradis really a great example of the next generation taking action toward more ethical procedures.

Jessica Owen
Can I ask what the process is then of working with brands? So Paradis, Perdue, they obviously have come across your website, perhaps, and they just get in touch with you. And then is it just a matter of beginning that life cycle assessment, the credibility? Do you just go through all those steps, and then it's as simple as that, really, and then they can put the label on their product. 

Dalia Benefatto
Yeah, well, they had all their recycled material certified. So this is already, GRS is already a guarantee for recycled material, and their supplier were really up to fill in the questionnaire. So this is the second step. And then the percentage of recycled material was calculated and and validated by the MO so yeah. And then they put a label on their on their garment. So when, when things are clear, they were very transparent. Also about their supply chain. There was no problem at all.

Jessica Owen
So the more honest and the more transparent companies are to begin with, the easier it's going to be for them. Really, that's an incentive for anyone to sort of, you know, clean up their supply chain.

Dalia Benefatto
Yeah, actually, you know it's, yeah, I think it's, it's right, what you what you're saying. Because actually, you know, communication gets much more easier if you are starting to be open in sharing what you are, what you are doing. And then if you are open, it can also be, of course, seen and and checked, and it can be also communicated in a in an easier way, because there is a faster communication, a faster exchange of information. And, yeah,

Jessica Owen
yeah. Interesting. Now I wanted to ask your thoughts on greenwashing, as this happens, I think quite a lot with sustainability. What are your tips then for spotting the truth from greenwashing? I imagine that when you have to be at this transparent company, you probably can tell the difference a lot easier than, say, consume.

Dalia Benefatto
Is, yeah, okay, we start with the with the very it is a very great question. Jessica, actually, green washing for us can be avoided looking for quantifiable data. So rebuke, at the moment, is one of the very few tools supplying data to the end consumer, and that's why the importance to get known and recognized by them, and we do hope that the path open will expand and become a common practice. So because of what said before, we are an independent third party, and we do ask for total transparency from our clients, all data and information needs to comply also with our standard, and if it doesn't, we do not deliver our service. So in fact, our position is between brands and consumers. So this also gives you the idea that there is a strong this is actually quite a strong statement. So if there is no transparency, we cannot help you with the communication. And that's actually not a small detail, it's a big thing, yeah? So

Jessica Owen
you literally turn people away if they're not transparent, you don't stand for any of that. So consumers can trust a label when they see it's remote, yeah?

Dalia Benefatto
So as you can see, the green washing can be avoided if you choose an ethical behavior and you follow it. You choose the rules for your for your program to work, and then you follow it. Because, actually, yeah, if, if a company is is not going to be transparent. That's what we that's what we do. We don't deliver the service. So

Jessica Owen
here's a question. Then some companies I've seen, for example, there's a knitted trainer footwear company. They publish all their transparency information themselves on their own websites, and that's brilliant. And I think any consumers would think, Oh, well, that's that's brave. I believe that information if they're sharing it with me. But do you think for people to really trust in a brand and their supply chain, it has to be someone like yourselves, who's a third party, just so it's there's no bias, that people really can trust it

Dalia Benefatto
well, you know, this is a very specific question. I think in our case, it's a plus, definitely, because I think it's a plus, it's a very good attitude. If you declare yourself, as I told you before, you make a declaration. So you make a declaration this this declaration can be also checked one day can be also verified. So you are actually already making a great step as a brand, as a company, to take responsibility about what you are doing. Of course, the third independent party validation, it makes your job even more crystal clear, even more you know. You really, you really show and you really that you are sure about what you're doing and that you are confident in, in the path that you are, that you are following. So it's definitely, let's say, perfecting something that is already on a good track. Yeah.

Jessica Owen
Okay, certainly. Now I know that remote K works primarily with recycled materials. Can I ask a bit more about this then? So do you know much about how efficient, say the current means of separating textile compositions for recycling are, and what are the challenges with working with recycled materials?

Dalia Benefatto
Yeah, that's another great question. Okay, we as remote. We are not a textile producing, handling or recycled company ourselves, but we have good connections with many companies through our network and a wide knowledge base. So it is important for our clients to have access to the best quality of recycled fibers available? Can we have a strong connection with a number of companies in the supply chain? We deal with the recycled material in Italy, Spain, Belgium and Germany as well, and the Netherlands, of course, where the founder and also the other group member are coming from, actually, so that I figured out developing the right technologies how to solve the all those companies we are connected with, they have figured out developing the right technologies how to solve major challenges related to the process of recycling textile materials. Because, you know, since a couple of. Years I joined this, this, this, I'm working cooperating with the remote key. I learned I had the possibility to see myself. That is a very, yeah, challenging procedure. It's quite a difficult procedure, but so if company asks, we can support them to find the right supplier of recycled fiber, yarns and fabric with recycled content. Because, in any case, there are really some, some excellent realities that they really can, can recycle in, in a great way, textile materials. Okay,

Jessica Owen
and so, sustainability, when people talk about this, can mean many things. It could be recycling, working with recycled materials like what you're sort of involved with, biodegradability, perhaps, and so on. So in your opinion, do you reckon that recycling and working with materials that already exist is maybe the most sustainable and the best way forward, or well,

Dalia Benefatto
using recycled materials certainly as a big benefits, waste reduction, environmentally lower, lowering of land depletion, and is, in our opinion, definitely one of the big steps forward and towards circular economy, but there are other great developments and innovations to enable a more conscious approach to the fashion and textile industry. As not all textiles can be successfully recycled yet Jessica because hopefully soon they're going to be all possible to be recycled. So remote is only focusing on the benefits of using recycled content to replace virgin fibers. So other aspects are not considered in the outcome of the remu key calculations. However we realize that there is much more that affects the sustainability of a textile product. That is why we are in the process of creating our own sustainability or LCA tool to take all these other aspects in consideration as well. This will result in a sister company be aware score, which will be launched later this year. So this is really a great news that I that I'm also telling you,

Jessica Owen
yeah, definitely I wasn't aware of that. How long is this plan been in the pipeline? Have you been working on it for a while? Hey,

Dalia Benefatto
you know, because all the imagine, all the complexity of the process, I was just roughly, because it was really, let's say, a simplified explanation about the calculation and the LCA and the database involved. And this was only for recycled fiber, imagine, for all the other kind of materials, how many more information they should be gathered. So it's it's quite sometimes that they are working on on this. Yeah,

Jessica Owen
it sounds like a very exciting move forward for you. And I mean, the idea for this, have you had brands come to you before who haven't worked with recycled materials, and they've asked if this is possible, is that one of the reasons you're doing this?

Dalia Benefatto
Well, there are also, to be honest with you, many of the supply chain are asking for a second label to use on their sustainable products, because making sustainable products with recycled material is only a part of what they're doing towards sustainability and circularity. So actually, to have a second tool that is expanding the calculation to all the other material. But then can you imagine to have something that is comparing to you one material versus the other. It's really also telling you, with data, this is the biggest thing, how to improve and which way to to pursue better for your company. Yeah,

Jessica Owen
definitely. Well, I mean, I asked you earlier whether you think one day, all garments will have a label on it and well, this step means that potentially that's possible, as everything is sort of hopefully going to be covered now,

Dalia Benefatto
and let's keep finger crossed. Jessica, yes, potentially Yes. 

Jessica Owen
Okay, now I also wanted to ask you another question. So a lot of people say that sustainable change will only happen if it works financially for companies. And I think I read that you think, from a business perspective, that this sort of new model, it is viable, is that. Right, if I read that right, could you explain?

Dalia Benefatto
Okay, I'm going to try to give you a perspective from two sides. Let's say the first one is that there is a big global movement among people towards more sensible and less damaging solutions in fashion textile production. So if brands and producers take action in a good and meaningful way, people will definitely appreciate and value these actions in growing numbers. But it takes determination, character and innovation for a company to shift gears. Fortunately, more and more take this challenge, and we believe they will see financial benefits, because consumers want to see this happen. On the other side, let's give a little bit a more industrial perspective, so the model is viable, also technically, as companies needs to work together, connected to circular economy. So there is the need of a switch from the linear system to a circular one, and by services and products in a protected environment. This because they need absolutely to trust each other and to be transparent and to be secure about where they are taking the material and how it is produced. So supply chain need to take responsibility and work toward product optimization, avoid waste product innovation and consent, consequently the decreasing of costs. So this is a little bit the the perspective that that we have that is embracing, let's say, two sides of the same matter, so the people awareness, but also the supply chain, taking responsibility as it's something that we have been saying a few times,

Jessica Owen
okay, I see Well, I mean, we're coming to an end now. But my final question then on that point is, do you think we'll ever get there? I mean, can we ever become sustainable and do all these lovely things? 

Dalia Benefatto
As I just said, we strongly believe that companies needs to change from linear to circular system, and this means a huge change with large investments, a more sensible, creative and technological innovative support will need to replace the old ways in brackets of only making the most profits. But we are also aware that this is a huge challenge for companies if they are not getting any governmental incentives. Jessica, because this is also a very big point. We believe that this consciousness shift is happening because the engagement, it is growing amongst people. But on the other side, you know, in the right governmental incentives are also going to to help a lot, being a consistent part for this change to happen.

Jessica Owen
And so can I ask then, are there many governmental initiative incentives out there? 

Dalia Benefatto
Yeah, well, let's say that EU is preparing itself. You know, with the there is a new Green Deal, there is a lot of of talk and and an action about that. But let's say that there are also, there is also a big amount of money that is going to be destined to the green economy. But you know, there is a big work to be done behind it, first of all, to to assign money to the right projects and to evaluate those right projects. And, yeah, let's say we are not as far as we would like to be.

Jessica Owen
Okay, yes, I think it's just such a huge, monumental effort that everyone's gonna have to do. But as you say, consumers are demanding it more. Millennials are demanding it more. So it's a change that will have to happen. I assume otherwise, companies will just fall behind.

Dalia Benefatto
You know that for to happen a big change. There are different things that they need to at the right time, in right moment, to, let's say, to to collapse together, to not collapse, but to get together so the people, the industry, and, of course, as we said, the governmental incentive. So for sure, we are on a good way, because the European Commission encourage eco innovation and and provide tools that can help to recognize green products as well. So we are definitely on the right path. So we have a lot of reason why to be very positive toward this, because actually there is a. A consciousness around that the greener economy means also new growth and job opportunities. So I think we have no, no reason why to be negative about

Jessica Owen
it. Well, that's a positive note to end on. I mean, so many of these questions, I'd like, they're such big questions, really we could explore them, and even just this idea of new opportunities and and jobs and everything. That's maybe a podcast for another day, but thank you so much for joining me this morning. It's been it's been great to hear about remote K and the processes and and good luck with your sister company as well. I hope all goes accordingly to plan.

Dalia Benefatto
Yes, thank you very much for the opportunity. Has been really a pleasure to talk with you, and I also want to thank you the bull remote team, first of all, for the effort, and second, also for the opportunity to talk about it, because it's really a nice project. Thank you very much.